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×åãî èñêàëà íå íàøëà, íî âîò íàòêíóëàñü íà òàêîå...
[Ññûëêè äîñòóïíû òîëüêî çàðåãèñòðèðîâàííûì ïîëüçîâàòåëÿì ] |
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#33
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Äà, Âû, Dr_Kozoliy, ïðàâû, ÿ òîëüêî ñåé÷àñ îñîçíàë ñóòü íàøèõ ðàçíîãëàñèé. Îíè â ýòîì:
Öèòàòà:
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#34
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Æåëàþ äîêòîðó íèêîãäà íå ïîïàñòü â ñèòóàöèþ, êîãäà äóìàåøü, ÷òî âñå ñäåëàíî êà÷åñòâåííî, à íà ñàìîì äåëå...
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#35
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Ñòîï-ñòîï...à íåäåíòàëüíàÿ, à ñêàæåì, Ro-ãðàôèÿ îðãàíîâ ãðóäíîé êëåòêè ïðè ãðóäíîì âñêàðìëèâàíèè (ò.å. ðåáåíîê óæå ðîäèëñÿ), îíà ÷òî, íåáåñîïàñíà? À åñëè áåçîïàñíà, òî çà÷åì ñöåæèâàòü? À åñëè îïàñíà, òî ÷åì, èçëó÷åíèåì îò "îáëó÷åííîãî" ìîëîêà?
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ðóêó êú ñåìó ïðèëîæèëú Àëåêñàíäðú |
#36
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Îïàñíîñòü íåäåíòàëüíîé òîæå íå äîêàçàíà. Ïðîñòî â äàííîì òîïèêå, êàê ìíå êàçàëîñü, ðå÷ü èìåííî î äåíòàëüíîé.
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#37
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Diagnostic imaging procedures during pregnancy
Jonathan B Kruskal, MD, PhD UpToDate performs a continuous review of over 375 journals and other resources. Updates are added as important new information is published. The literature review for version 15.3 is current through August 2007; this topic was last changed on September 14, 2007. The next version of UpToDate (16.1) will be released in March 2008. SUMMARY AND RECOMMENDATIONS FOR IMAGING PREGNANT OR POSSIBLY PREGNANT WOMEN Ideally, radiologic procedures are scheduled during the first half (follicular phase) of the cycle. All women of childbearing potential should be questioned as to whether they could be pregnant at the time of a radiologic examination. If any doubt exists, a pregnancy test should be obtained prior to the diagnostic procedure. The perceived risk of radiation exposure is much greater than the actual risk, but a full explanation of these risks to the woman and her family is best given prior, rather than after, the exposure [32]. During pregnancy, alternative imaging procedures (eg, ultrasound, MR imaging) should be considered in preference to those that apply ionizing radiation. However, concern about the possible effects of ionizing radiation should not prevent medically indicated diagnostic procedures using the best available modality. When procedures requiring ionizing radiation are necessary, various techniques can be employed to minimize the radiation dose. (See "Issues by type of diagnostic imaging procedure" above). Ultrasonography and MR imaging are not associated with known adverse fetal effects. However, MR imaging is not recommended in the first trimester since safety information during organogenesis is limited. (See "MR imaging" above). Radiation risks should be discussed with the pregnant patient, including an explanation of the background population risk for miscarriage, congenital anomalies, genetic disease, and growth restriction (approximately 20, 4, 10, and 10 percent, respectively). Consultation with a radiologist should be obtained to plan the optimum study using the least amount of radiation or to reconstruct the amount of radiation exposure from examinations performed prior to knowledge of the pregnancy. (See "Effects of ionizing radiation on the fetus" above). The best estimate of the threshold for preimplantation death is more than 10 rads. At this stage of pregnancy intact survival or death are the most likely outcomes, radiation induced noncancer abnormalities are not likely regardless of the radiation dose. (See "Preimplantation" above). Radiation exposure of less than 0.05 Gy (5 rad) has not been associated with an increased risk of abortion, congenital anomalies, growth restriction, or perinatal mortality. There may be a small increased risk of childhood cancer, 1 in 2000 versus the 1 in 3000 background rate. (See "Effects of ionizing radiation on the fetus" above). |
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#39
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ß íå ñòîìàòîëîã è íå ðàäèîëîã, íî ÈÌÕÎ, êîíå÷íî
è íàçûâàåòñÿ "íåëîãè÷íî". À è íàçûâàåòñÿ "ÿòðîãåíèÿ"
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Ñ óâàæåíèåì, Âàëåðèé Âàëåðüåâè÷ Ñàìîéëåíêî |
#40
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Ñîáñòâåííî, ýòó ôðàçó ÿ ïðåäëîæèëà áû â êà÷åñòâå ýïèãðàôà ê ýòîìó òîïèêó.
Åùå åñòü ïîãîâîðêà ïðî "ìåíüøå çíàåøü - êðåï÷å ñïèøü", íî â äàííîì ñëó÷àå åå íàäî êàê-òî ïðåîáðàçîâàòü âî ÷òî-òî òèïà "ìåíüøå ôàíòàçèðóåøü - óñòîé÷èâåå ïñèõèêà". |
#41
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Ó íàñ, êñòàòè, îäíà äîêòîð óñòðîèëà ñöåíó ñ êðèêîì, êîãäà ó ïàöèåíòêè âìåñòî êàðèåñà îêàçàëñÿ ïóëüïèò. Ñöåíà íà òåìó "×òî æå òåïåðü äåëàòü?!" Ñ îäíîé ñòîðîíû äîêòîð î÷åíü îïàñàåòñÿ ñóäåáíûõ èñêîâ ïî ïîâîäó íåêà÷åñòâåííîãî ëå÷åíèÿ (à ñ àïåêñëîêàòîðîì ó íåå îòíîøåíèÿ êàê-òî íå ñëîæèëèñü), ñ äðóãîé ñòîðîíû, êàê è äîêòîð Êîçîëèé, óâåðåíà, ÷òî ñíèìêè áåðåìåííûì äåëàòü íåëüçÿ. È, êàê íàçëî, íè îäíîãî ýíäîäîíòèñòà ñ ìèêðîñêîïîì íà íàøèõ êðàÿõ íå çàâåëîñü. Ïðèéòè ê êîíñåíñóñó íå óäàëîñü.  ïðîöåññå äèñêóññèè äîêòîð íàîðàëà íà âñåõ, â òîì ÷èñëå íà äèðåêòîðà êëèíèêè. Êñòàòè, âàø âîïðîñ, Äîêòîð Êîçîëèé ïðî "à âû ñåáå áû ñäåëàëè" äëÿ ìåíÿ íå íîâ. Ñäåëàëà áû. Ïî îáëåäåíåâøèì äîðîãàì õîäèòü íà ðàáîòó ñ ðèñêîì ïîäñêîëüçíóòüñÿ è óïàñòü ñòðàøíåå.
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#42
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..îé, ãîñïîäà, âîîáùå ãðóñòíî.
Booker, âû îïÿòü ìåíÿ íå ïîíÿëè. Óïîâàþ íà ñâîþ êîñíîÿçû÷íîñòü. Ïèñàëà, äà òàê è çíàëà, ÷òî âû ïðèöåïèòåñü èìåííî ê ýòîé ôðàçå. Âàñ òóò òàê ìíîãî, è íàáðîñèëèñü, è çàêëåâàëè. Øàíñîâ ó ìåíÿ - íîëü, îòäàþ îò÷åò. Âñÿ íàøà ïðîáëåìà â òîì, ÷òî ó âàñ "ýíäîäîíòèñòà íå çàâàëÿëîñü", à ó íàñ - çàâàëÿëèñü. ß íèêîãäà íå áóäó ñòàâèòü çíàê ðàâåíñòâà ìåæäó ïàöèåíòêîé áåðåìåííîé è íåáåðåìåííîé, àïðèîðè. ÍÅ ÍÀÂÐÅÄÈ...? ß, íå ñäåëàÿ ñíèìîê, íå íàâðåæó òî÷íî. Î ÊÀ×ÅÑÒÂÅ â ýòîì ðàçäåëå íå ñóäèì, Booker, õîðîøî, ïîòîìó ÷òî âû ìîèõ êîíòðîëåé íå âèäåëè, èîòäàëåííûõ ðåçóëüòàòîâ òîæå, êàê è ÿ - âàøèõ. Åñëè ó âàñ îøèáî÷íî ñëîæèëîñü ìíåíèå, ÷òî ÿ òóò øàøêîé ìàøó è êðè÷ó, ÿ ìîë íå íóæåí ìíå íè ñíèìîê, íè àïåêñëîêàòîð ÿ êðóòà äî áåçîáðàçèÿ, òî âû ÷òî õîòåëè ïðî÷åñòü, òî è ïðî÷èòàëè. Êòî-òî ñòåáàëñÿ ïðî "è åùå ÊÒ òàì ñäåëàòü"- ó íàñ ïî ñòàíäàðòàì, áåðÿñü çà ýíäîäîíòè÷åñêîå ëå÷åíèå âû ÎÁßÇÀÍÛ ñäåëàòü ìèíèìóì òðè ñíèìêà. Äî, â ïðîöåññå, è êîíòðîëü ïëîìáèðîâàíèÿ ("ôîáèè íà ìåñòàõ", "òóïîå íà÷àëüñòâî"...ýòî íå íàøè ìåñòå÷êîâûå ñòàíäàðòû, âçÿòû îíè íà ïðèìåðàõ ëó÷øèõ åâðîïåéñêèõ êëèíèê, è âðåäà òàêîé êîíòðîëü íå ïðèíåñ íèêîìó åùå). À åñëè âû äåëàåòå îäèí...íó òóò òîãäà òîæå âñå ÿñíî êàê äåíü. Ìîëîäöû âû, âñåõ ÷åøåòå ïîä îäíó ãðåáåíêó, ïðèêðûâàÿñü òåì, ÷òî "äî ÷åãî äîøåë ïðîãðåññ, äî íåâèäàííûõ ÷óäåñ". À ÿ ñâîåé çàäà÷åé âèæó íå òîëüêî íàáðîñèòüñÿ íà êàæäîãî, è ëå÷èòü-ëå÷èòü-ëå÷èòü è ðóáàòü áàáëî(èëè óåò, ÷òî òàì êòî ðàáîòàåò ó âàñ), à åùå ÷òîáû ñ ïðèåìà ÷åëîâåê óõîäèë ñïîêîéíûé, è ïîòîì íå äóìàëîñü. Foxa íå ïîíÿëà äëÿ ÷åãî áûëà ðàññêàçàíà èñòîðèÿ ïðî èñòåðè÷êó èç âàøèõ êðàåâ. Ó ìåíÿ ñ àïåêñëîêàòîðîì êàê ðàç âñå íîðìàëüíî...áîëåå òîãî, ïîäîçðåâàþ, ÷òî îí íå âàø äðóã, åñëè âû êàæäîé áåðåìåííîé, ðàâíî êàê è êàæäîìó ìóæèêó è ðåáåíêó ïîôèãó êàêîãî âîçðàñòà ãîòîâû äåëàòü ñíèìêè. Ïðî "êèðïè÷ íà ãîëîâó" èñòîðèÿ ñòàðàÿ, òåìíàÿ, ñëûøàíà íå ðàç, è îáúÿñíÿåòñÿ íåæåëàíèåì èäòè íà êîìïðîìèññû, è áûòü ãèá÷å â ñóæäåíèÿõ. Îáîñòðåíèå ïåðèîäîíòèòà, áåðåìåííàÿ, ìîè äåéñòâèÿ: 1. Ðàñêðûòü çóá, ïðîçîíäèðîâàòü êàíàëû, âûÿñíèòü ñîäåðæèìîå. Çóá ðàíåå ëå÷åí, åñëè ïàñòà, ãóòòàïåð÷à èëè ÷òî-ëèáî,íå ïðåäñòàâëÿþùåå ñîáîé òâåðäóþ ñóáñòàíöèþ, ÿ è áåç ñíèìêà ëîêàëèçóþ êàíàëû(êàê ïðàâèëî, íî íå âñåãäà, áûâàåò âñÿêîå!), åñëè çíàòü ×ÒÎ è ÃÄÅ èñêàòü....íàéòè - íå ïðîáëåìà. Ñ áèíîêóëÿðíîé îïòèêîé êàê ìèíèìóì. Ñîçäàì ïðîõîäèìîñòü âåðõóøåê è ïîëó÷ó îòäåëÿåìîå. Ñíèìó îáîñòðåíèå.Ãèäðîîêèñü, âðåìåííàÿ è âïðåä â ðîääîì. 2. Åñëè ôîñôàò? ßäðåíûé ðåçîðöèí? Âû íåâîîðóæåííûì ãëàçîì áóäåòå êîâûðÿòü? (ïðîñòèòå íåêóëüòóðíîå ñëîâî, íî äðóãèì íå ìîãó íàçâàòü). Åñëè íå çàâàëÿëñÿ ìèêðîñêîï ó âàñ. Õîðîøî, äî èçãèáà äîêîâûðÿåòå, äàëüøå ÷òî? Äàëüøå áóäåòå ïåðôîðàöèè äåëàòü? Ñíèìêè, íå ìîæåòå ïðîéòè. Íó ôîñôàò òàì. Ðåçîðöèí! Áîëèò. Àíòèáèîòèêè áåðåìåííîé íàçíà÷èòå? ß - îòïðàâëþ íà ìèêðîñêîï.Îíè-ïðîéäóò. Åñëè íå ïðîéäóò, èòîã îäèí - óäàëåíèå. È ñíèìêè òóò íè ïðè ÷åì, îäíàêî... Íå áûëî ìèêðîñêîïà, óäàëÿëè. Áåðåìåííûì - óäàëÿëè. Ãîñïîäà, ðåàëüíî íå áóäó ïðîäîëæàòü äèñïóò(êòî ÷òî äóìàåò - ìàëîãðàìîòíàÿ ÿ, ñàìîóâåðåííàÿ íåäîó÷êà èëè åùå ÷òî, âàøå ïðàâî), ïîòîìó êàê øàíñîâ íåò, âàñ ìíîãî, âñå òàêèå çàñëóæåííûå, à ÿ îäíà, íåñóùàÿ åðåñü. Îäèí â ïîëå íå âîèí. ß òîëüêî õîòåëà ñêàçàòü - íà ïðèåìå íå ìîæåò ñòîÿòü çíàêà ðàâåíñòâà ìåæäó æåíùèíîé è æåíùèíîé áåðåìåííîé. Âî âñ¸ì, è â âîïðîñå ñíèìêîâ òîæå. À åñëè âû åãî ñòàâèòå - çíà÷èò...âàì âñ¸ îäíî, ïîòîê, ïîòîê.... ÷òî æ ïîëèêëèíè÷åñêèé ïðèåì ñ ëþäüìè ñäåëàë. Íåñèòå ñâîè çíàíèÿ â ìàññû, âàøè ìåòîäû èìåþò ïðàâî íà ñóùåñòâîâàíèå. Óäàëÿþñü, êëàíÿþñü íèçêî, ïðîøó ïðîùåíèÿ åñëè êîãî îáèäåëà, ëè÷íî ìíå - áûëî çàáàâíî. |
#43
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Íå äóìàþ, ÷òî êòî-òî èìåë öåëüþ Âàñ çàêëåâàòü. Òåì áîëåå, ÷òî íàñ (ñòîìàòîëîãîâ), ðåãóëÿðíî ñþäà çàõîäÿùèõ, âñåãî-òî ÷åòûðå ÷åëîâåêà.
È âðîäå ïðîôåññîðîâ ñðåäè íàñ íåòó. Íà ñàìîì äåëå âñ¸ äîñòàòî÷íî ïðîñòî. Åñëè ôîðìóëèðîâàòü êîðîòêî, òî "ñêàçàë - áóäü ãîòîâ ïðåäîñòàâèòü ÂÅÑÊÈÅ (ò.å. íàó÷íûå) àðãóìåíòû â çàùèòó ñâîåãî ìíåíèÿ". È âñ¸. Ìîãó Âàñ óâåðèòü, ÷òî äàæå îäèí ÷åëîâåê ïðè òàêîì ïîäõîäå âïîëíå ìîæåò óáåäèòü êó÷ó ñîìíåâàþùèõñÿ (÷òî è áûâàåò èíîãäà). Íåñìîòðÿ íè íà ÷òî, íàäåþñü, ÷òî Âû âñ¸ æå áóäåòå ê íàì çàãëÿäûâàòü. |
#44
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ß ñàìîóâåðåíàÿ íåäîó÷êà, à âû âñå õâàòàåòå è ëå÷èòå âñåõ ïîäðÿä, ðóáèòå áàáëî. Ýòî óæå "ëèòåðàòóðà" êàêàÿ-òî ïîøëà. Àõ.. ïîëèêëèíè÷åñêèé ïðèåì..
Âû âñåãî-ëèøü âûñêàçàëè óòâåðæäåíèå è íå ñìîãëè åãî äîêàçàòü. Áåðåìåííûìè æåíùèíàìè ñëèøêîì ÷àñòî èãðàþò â ôóòáîë ê ñîæàëåíèþ. Î÷åíü íåïðèÿòíî, êîãäà â ñòàöèîíàð ïîëó÷àåøü áîëüíóþ ñ îáîñòðåíèåì ïåðèîäîíòèòà, êîòîðóþ íåïîíÿòíî çà÷åì íàïðàâèëè è çàïèñü ãèíåêîëîãà â êàðòå "ðåíòãåíîãðàôèÿ ïðîòèâîïîêàçàíà, àíåñòåçèÿ ïðîòèâîïîêàçàíà".  èòîãå áîëüíàÿ ñàìà ðàçâîðà÷èâàåòñÿ è óõîäèò áåç îêàçàíèÿ ïîìîùè. Âèäèìî ó òåõ, êòî èõ íàïðàâëÿåò, íåò ìèêðîñêîïà.. Èëè ïîòîê çàíèìàòüñÿ ìåøàåò... |
#45
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Öèòàòà:
Èñêðåííå ãîâîðþ - Âû î÷åíü íóæíûé çäåñü ÷åëîâåê, åñòü ó Âàñ íàøà õâàòêà, à òàêæå ìíîãî è ïðàâîòû â Âàøèõ ðàññóæäåíèÿõ, ìíîãèå âîïðîñû - ôèëîñîôñêîãî ñâîéñòâà. Ýòà òåìà - ìîæåò áûòü ñåáÿ è èñ÷åðïàëà, íî ïðîøó Âàñ ïðîäîëæèòü àêòèâíîå ó÷àñòèå â ðàáîòå ôîðóìà âîîáùå. Ýêêëåçèàñò - âðåìÿ ñîáèðàòü êàìíè |