#16
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Äà ê òîìó è ñïîðèòü, ÷òî ÈÍÏ èãðàåò ñâîþ ðîëü â ãåíåçå íîñîâûõ êðîâîòå÷åíèé, áóäü îíè ïåðâè÷íûå èëè âòîðè÷íûå. Ýòî ôàêò. È íå íàäî ññûëàòñÿ íà òî ÷òî â ó÷åáíèêàõ ïèøóò íåïðàâäó.
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#17
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Ïèøóò íåïðàâäó, è åùå êàêóþ... êîíêðåòíî - ÂÑÄ êàê ïðè÷èíà... Ìîæåò ëè áûòü ïðè÷èíîé íåñóùåñòâóþùåå çàáîëåâàíèå?
__________________
Lead, follow, or get out of the way. — Thomas Paine |
#18
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Íó ñ ÂÑÄ - ýòî íå ê îòîðèíîëàðèíãîëîãàì. Ïî ìîåìó îïûòó "äèàãíîç" "ÂÑÄ" ñòàâÿò ëþáîìó ïîäðîñòêó, êîòîðûé ïðèäåò â ïîëèêëèíèêó.
ÈÍÏ è ñîïóòñâóþùèå ïðîöåññû ìîãóò ñòàòü ôàêòîðîìè ñïîñîáñòâóþùèìè íîñîâûì êðîâîòå÷åíèÿì.. |
#19
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Ýòî íåõîðîøèé îïûò... íå íàäî åãî áðàòü íà âîîðóæåíèå. Íåò òàêîé áîëåçíè.
__________________
Lead, follow, or get out of the way. — Thomas Paine |
#20
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Âû ìåíÿ íåïðàâèëüíî ïîíÿëè.
Ïðèõîäèò íà êîíñóëüòàöèþ ïàöèåíò - à òàì â êàðòî÷êå "ÂÑÄ". È ñòàâÿò ýòîò äèàãíîç òîòàëüíî. ß òàêîé äèàãíîç íå ñòàâëþ. Ïðèõîäèòñÿ ÷èòàòü. À åùå ãàñòðîýçîôàãåàëüíûé ðåôëþêñ ó íàñ ñòàâÿò ïî÷òè âñåì êòî ïðîõîäèò ÔÃÑ. Ýòî òàê ê ñëîâó. Äàâàéòå íå áóäåì "çàñîðÿòü" ôîðóì ËÎÐîâ îôòîïíûìè ñîîáùåíèÿìè. |
#21
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Äàâàéòå áóäåì êîíñóëüòèðîâàòü íà îñíîâå ÄÌ. Òîãäà è îôôòîïà íå áóäåò.
Êòî ãäå è ÷åãî ñòàâèò - ìíîãî ïðî ýòî ìîæíî ðàññêàçûâàòü.
__________________
Lead, follow, or get out of the way. — Thomas Paine |
#22
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À ÿ è ñòàðàþñü êîíñóëüòèðîâàòü ñ ïîçèöèé ÄÌ.
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#23
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Ïðîñòèòå ÷òî âëåçàþ ñî ñâîåé íåïðîôåññèîíàëüíîé òî÷êè çðåíèÿ, íî, èìõî, êðîâîòå÷åíèÿ-îò-ÂÑÄ çà ðóáåæîì íàçûâàþò ïðîñòî "áîëüøèíñòâî ñëó÷àåâ íîñîâîãî êðîâîòå÷åíèÿ - ñïîíòàííû è èäèîïàòè÷åñêè" .
Íî, êñòàòè, èñêðèâëåííàÿ íîñîâàÿ ïåðåãîðîäêà ñ÷èòàåòñÿ ôàêòîðîì ðèñêà äëÿ ïîâòîðíûõ êðîâîòå÷åíèé - íó òàì, âûñûõàíèå è ïîâðåæäåíèå ñëèçèñòîé òàì ãäå òîê âîçäóõà òóðáóëåíòíûé è âñå â ýòîì äóõå, ìîãó äàæå íàéòè è ïðîöèòèðîâàòü . PS À ìîæåò áûòü, êðîâîòå÷åíèå îò ÂÑÄ - ýòî epistaxis digitorum? |
#24
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Óâàæàåìûå êîëëåãè!
Âîçâðàùàÿñü ê ïåðâè÷íîìó ñëó÷àþ íîñîâûõ êðîâîòå÷åíèé ó äåòåé: In case of severe or recurrent epistaxis, one must look for a bleeding disorder or a nasal/nasopharyngeal tumour, especially juvenile nasopharyngeal angiofibroma in adolescent males. Chemical or electrical cautery of the septum should be suggested in case of recurrent idiopathic epistaxis. Èç Arch Pediatr. 1996 Aug;3(8):806-13. [Epistaxis in children] Francois M. Âîò îòå÷åñòâåííàÿ ðàáîòà: Vestn Otorinolaringol. 1991 Nov-Dec;(6):38-41. [Pre-hospital diagnosis of nosebleed in children] Doroshenko LA, Barkagan LZ, Sokolova GS, Kosikhina TA. Early signs of haemorrhages develop in the childhood, nose bleeding being predominant. Recurrent nose bleeding was observed in 130 (89.0%) patients with thrombocytopathies, 37 patients with nasal pathologies, 13 out of 14 children having willebrand's disease, 3 patients suffering from Rendu-Osler disease, in a boy with a factor XIII deficiency, and in a girl with psoriasis. In the case of haemorrhagic diathesis, nose bleeding was, as a rule, combined with haemorrhages of other types (skin, gum, uterine, etc.) whereas in the case of ENT pathology, nose bleeding was the only haemorrhagic symptom.
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Èñêðåííå, Âàäèì Âàëåðüåâè÷. |
#25
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Îïèøó èíòåðåñíûé ñëó÷àé, íàáëþäàë â òå÷åíèè íåäåëè: îáðàòèëàñü äåâî÷êà 13 ëåò ñ îáèëüíûì êðîâîòå÷åíèåì èç ïðàâîãî óõà. Íà ìîìåíò ïðèõîäà âñÿ â êðîâè, íî êðîâîòå÷åíèå îñòàíîâèëîñü, êîæà í.ñ.ï. íå èçìåíåíà, âñÿ êðîâü â õðÿùåâîì îòäåëå, êîñòíûé îòäåë è á/ïåðåïîíêà á/î, ñëóõ â íîðìå. ×èùó í.ñ.ï. äî÷èñòà è ïîñëå ìàññàæà êîçåëêà âèæó âëàæóþ ãåìîððàãè÷åñêóþ òî÷êó ñðàçó çà íèì ê âåðõíåé ñòåíêå, íî íå êðîâèò. Ñîïóòñòâóþùàÿ æàëîáà: ñèëüíûå áîëè â çàòûëî÷íîé îáëàñòè, 3 ãîäà íàçàä ÑÃÌ ëåãêîé ñò., ÀÄ 120/80, mensis "-" . Îòïðàâëÿþ ñ ñàíèòàðêîé ÷åðåç äîðîãó â ïîë-êó ê íåâðîëîãó,âîçâðàùàåòñÿ ñ êðîâîòå÷åíèåì è ïðåäâ.DS: ÂÑÄ(êàê áû íå êðèòèêîâàëè ýòîò DS, îí åùå äîëãî áóäåò ôèãóðèðîâàòü â íàïðàâëåíèÿõ), ãîñïèòàëèçèðóþ ïîñòàâèâ òóãóþ òàìïîíàäó, ïåðèîäàìè ïîäêðàâëèâàåò ÷åðåç òàìïîíàäó. Íåäåëþ íå âèæó, çíàþ ÷òî ïîëó÷àåò âñþ äîñòóïíóþ àíòèãåìîððàãè÷åñêóþ òåðàïèþ, êðîâü = N, ÀÄ òîæå, íî ïðîäîëæàåò êðîâèòü ïî 3-4 ð/ñóò. è î÷åíü îáèëüíî, ñìîòðÿò âñå ïîñòîâûå ËÎÐû+ïåäèàòð-èñòî÷íèê íå îáíàðóæåí, ñîõðàíÿþòñÿ ãîë.áîëè â çàòûëêå(êñòàòè ïîãîäà ðåçêî ìåíÿëàñü â ýòè äíè). Äåâî÷êà ïîïàäàåòñÿ ìíå ñíîâà ïî äåæóðñòâó âíîâü ñ îáèëüíûì êðîâîòå÷åíèåì, âîçíèêøèì ëåæà â ïîêîå, èñòî÷íèê íå âèäåí, äåëàþ áëîêàäó â ïðåäïîëàãàåìîå ìåñòî êðîâîòå÷åíèÿ-íà íåñêîëüêî ñóòîê óõî êðîâèòü ïåðåñòàåò, íî ïàðàäîêñ - íà÷èíàþòñÿ íîñîâûå êðîâîòå÷åíèÿ, ëåãêî êóïèðóþòñÿ ñåðåáðîì, íî òàêæå ëåãêî âîçîáíîâëÿþòñÿ ÷åðåç ïàðó ÷àñîâ(â ïîêîå), ïîñëå 3-ãî äåëàþ òàìïîíàäó, Àíåñòåçèîëîã âûÿâëÿåò ðàçíèöó ÀÄ: ïðàâàÿ ðóêà 110/70, ëåâàÿ 130/85. Êîí÷èëîñü ïåðåâîäîì â ñîìàòèêó ñ DS: ÂÑÄ. Ìîðàëü ñåé áàñíè òàêîâà: ÂÑÄ ïóñòü íè î ÷åì, íî óäîáíûé äëÿ âñåõ DS, íà êîòîðûé ìîæíî ñïèñàòü âñå, ÷òî õî÷åøü.
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#26
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Âîò èçâèíèòå, íî ÿ íå ïîíèìàþ, êàê ýòî "íå âèäåí èñòî÷íèê êðîâîòå÷åíèÿ" èç óõà. À åñëè êðîâü óáðàòü, íåóæåëè íå âèäíà òî÷êà, îòêóäà êðîâèò?
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#27
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Í/Ê
Öèòàòà:
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#28
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Öèòàòà:
__________________
Lead, follow, or get out of the way. — Thomas Paine |
#29
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Öèòàòà:
Òàê ÷åì äåëî óñïîêîèëîñü ñ äåâî÷êîé? Ìîæåò…… ýêòîïèÿ ýíäîìåòðèÿ (â êà÷åñòâå áðåäà) è Âû áîðîëèñü ñ ïåðâîé ìåíñòðóàöèåé? Ïî÷åìó ãîëîâà ó íåå áîëåëà, âûÿñíèëè? |
#30
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À ïðîçîíäèðîâàòü ïóãîâ÷àòûì íå ïðîáîâàëè ýòó òî÷êó-ïðèçðàê.
Ïîìíèòå, åñòü òàêèå ïåðèàóðèêóëÿðíûå âðîæäåííûå ñâèùè ó äåòåé. Èç äðóãèõ ïðåäïîëîæåíèé - õåìîäåêòîìà (ãëîìóñíàÿ îïóõîëü) â áàðàáàííîé ïîëîñòè. Òî÷íî ëè ïåðåïîíêà èíòàêòíà? |