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Îòâåò
 
Îïöèè òåìû Ïîèñê â ýòîé òåìå Îïöèè ïðîñìîòðà
  #16  
Ñòàðûé 09.05.2024, 01:51
ghrh44 ghrh44 âíå ôîðóìà
ÂÐÀ×
      
 
Ðåãèñòðàöèÿ: 21.07.2014
Ãîðîä: N-sk
Ñîîáùåíèé: 3,999
Ïîáëàãîäàðèëè 2,051 ðàç(à) çà 1,895 ñîîáùåíèé
ghrh44 ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåghrh44 ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåghrh44 ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåghrh44 ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåghrh44 ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåghrh44 ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåghrh44 ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåghrh44 ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåghrh44 ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåghrh44 ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåghrh44 ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìå
Íàñ÷åò âèòàìèíà D: â äâîéíûõ ñëåïûõ, ïëàöåáî-êîíòðîëèðîâàííûõ ïðîòîêîëàõ íîðìàëèçàöèÿ åãî óðîâíåé íè íà ãðîø íå èçìåíèëà ãëþêîçó, ãëèêîãåìîãëîáèí è ÷óâñòâèòåëüíîñòü ê èíñóëèíó
DOI: 10.1111/dom.12794
[Ññûëêè äîñòóïíû òîëüêî çàðåãèñòðèðîâàííûì ïîëüçîâàòåëÿì ][

 ëó÷øåì ñëó÷àå, âëèÿíèå âèòàìèíà D íà äèàáåò “íå äîêàçàíî”, â õóäøåì - “ âûäà÷à æåëàåìîãî çà äåéñòâèòåëüíîå” . A òàê êàê áîëüøèíñòâî ñòàòåé îïèñûâàþò ìåòààíàëèçû ñ âêëþ÷åíèåì ïðèìèòèâíûõ ïðîòîêîëîâ , òî ïîëîæèòåëüíûé ñóììàðíûé ýôôåêò íåèçáåæåí:-)
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Dr.B
Îòâåòèòü ñ öèòèðîâàíèåì
  #17  
Ñòàðûé 09.05.2024, 17:31
Àâàòàð äëÿ Dr.Vad
Dr.Vad Dr.Vad âíå ôîðóìà
Ìîäåðàòîð ôîðóìà ïî ãåìàòîëîãèè
      
 
Ðåãèñòðàöèÿ: 16.01.2003
Ãîðîä: Õüþñòîí, Òåõàñ
Ñîîáùåíèé: 80,732
Ïîáëàãîäàðèëè 33,407 ðàç(à) çà 31,752 ñîîáùåíèé
Dr.Vad ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåDr.Vad ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåDr.Vad ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåDr.Vad ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåDr.Vad ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåDr.Vad ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåDr.Vad ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåDr.Vad ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåDr.Vad ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåDr.Vad ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåDr.Vad ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìå
Íàñ÷åò âèòàìèíà Ä äîêòîðà-åíäîêðèíîëîãè èç ìåä öåíòðà Òàôòñ, Áîñòîí, èíîãî ìíåíèÿ, è ïîêà â ïåðåïèñêå â æóðíàëå èõ íàõîäêè íèêòî íå îñïîðèë:

In adults with prediabetes, vitamin D was effective in decreasing risk for diabetes.

Vitamin D and Risk for Type 2 Diabetes in People With Prediabetes A Systematic Review and Meta-analysis of Individual Participant Data From 3 Randomized Clinical Trials
Anastassios G. Pittas, MD, MS et al.

Ann Intern Med. 2023 Mar;176(3):355-363. doi: 10.7326/M22-3018.
ïîëíûé òåêñò ïóáëèêàöèè â ïäô äîñòóïåí íà ÿïîíñêîì ñàéòå ïî ññûëêå íèæå:
[Ññûëêè äîñòóïíû òîëüêî çàðåãèñòðèðîâàííûì ïîëüçîâàòåëÿì ]
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Èñêðåííå,
Âàäèì Âàëåðüåâè÷.
Îòâåòèòü ñ öèòèðîâàíèåì
  #18  
Ñòàðûé 09.05.2024, 18:16
Àâàòàð äëÿ Melnichenko
Melnichenko Melnichenko íà ôîðóìå
ÂÐÀ×
      
 
Ðåãèñòðàöèÿ: 26.07.2001
Ãîðîä: Ìîñêâà
Ñîîáùåíèé: 117,410
Ñêàçàë(à) ñïàñèáî: 26
Ïîáëàãîäàðèëè 33,669 ðàç(à) çà 32,743 ñîîáùåíèé
Melnichenko ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåMelnichenko ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåMelnichenko ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåMelnichenko ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåMelnichenko ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåMelnichenko ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåMelnichenko ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåMelnichenko ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåMelnichenko ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåMelnichenko ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåMelnichenko ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìå
È äàæå áåç Õîëèêà ïóáëèêàöèÿ…
Äàâàéòå îòíåñåìñÿ ñî ñäåðæàííûì ñêåïòèöèçìîì
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Ã.À. Ìåëüíè÷åíêî
Îòâåòèòü ñ öèòèðîâàíèåì
  #19  
Ñòàðûé 09.05.2024, 18:33
Àâàòàð äëÿ Dr.Vad
Dr.Vad Dr.Vad âíå ôîðóìà
Ìîäåðàòîð ôîðóìà ïî ãåìàòîëîãèè
      
 
Ðåãèñòðàöèÿ: 16.01.2003
Ãîðîä: Õüþñòîí, Òåõàñ
Ñîîáùåíèé: 80,732
Ïîáëàãîäàðèëè 33,407 ðàç(à) çà 31,752 ñîîáùåíèé
Dr.Vad ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåDr.Vad ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåDr.Vad ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåDr.Vad ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåDr.Vad ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåDr.Vad ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåDr.Vad ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåDr.Vad ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåDr.Vad ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåDr.Vad ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåDr.Vad ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìå
Ãàëèíà Àôàíàñüåâíà, äð. Holick MF ïîñëåäíèé ðàç ïèñàë îá ýòîì áîëåå 15 ëåò íàçàä

Diabetes and the vitamin d connection.
Holick MF.
Curr Diab Rep. 2008 Oct;8(5):393-8.

ïåðâûé àâòîð - ó÷àñòíèê îäíîãî èç êëèí. òðàéëîâ, ãäå öåëåíàïðàâëåííî èçó÷àëñÿ âèòàìèí Ä äëÿ ïðåäóïðåæäåíèÿ äèàáåòà (D2d)

äàííàÿ ïóáëèêàöèÿ - èíäèâèäóàëüíûé àíàëèç 3 èñëåäîâàíèé, ðåç-òû êîòîðûõ îïóáëèêîâàíû â ïîñëåäíèå 8 ëåò, ïîýòîìó âñå àâòîðû äàííîãî àíàëèçà - ó÷àñòíèêè âñåõ ýòèõ òðàéëîâ èç 3 ðàçíûõ ñòðàí, ó êîãî åñòü äîñòóï ê áàçàì äàííûõ èíä. ïàöèåíòîâ

Pittas AG, Dawson-Hughes B, Sheehan P, et al; D2d Research
Group. Vitamin D supplementation and prevention of type 2 diabetes.
N Engl J Med. 2019;381:520-30. [PMID: 31173679]

Jorde R, Sollid ST, Svartberg J, et al. Vitamin D 20,000 IU per
week for five years does not prevent progression from prediabetes
to diabetes. J Clin Endocrinol Metab. 2016;101:1647-55.

Kawahara T, Suzuki G, Mizuno S, et al. Effect of active vitamin D
treatment on development of type 2 diabetes: DPVD randomised
controlled trial in Japanese population. BMJ. 2022;377:e066222.
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Èñêðåííå,
Âàäèì Âàëåðüåâè÷.
Îòâåòèòü ñ öèòèðîâàíèåì
  #20  
Ñòàðûé 09.05.2024, 18:56
Àâàòàð äëÿ Dr.Vad
Dr.Vad Dr.Vad âíå ôîðóìà
Ìîäåðàòîð ôîðóìà ïî ãåìàòîëîãèè
      
 
Ðåãèñòðàöèÿ: 16.01.2003
Ãîðîä: Õüþñòîí, Òåõàñ
Ñîîáùåíèé: 80,732
Ïîáëàãîäàðèëè 33,407 ðàç(à) çà 31,752 ñîîáùåíèé
Dr.Vad ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåDr.Vad ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåDr.Vad ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåDr.Vad ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåDr.Vad ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåDr.Vad ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåDr.Vad ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåDr.Vad ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåDr.Vad ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåDr.Vad ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåDr.Vad ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìå
Àâòîðû îïÿòü æå óêàçûâàþò ÷òî âî âñåõ òðàéëàõ åñòü ýôôåêò ñíèæåíèÿ ðèñêà äèàáåòà, íî òðàéëû íå áûëè äîñòàòî÷íî âåëèêè, ÷òîáû åå óâèäåòü ñî ñòàòèñòè÷åñêîé òî÷êè çðåíèÿ - îòñóòñòâèå ñòàòèñòèêè íå âñåãäà ÍÅÒ ýôôåêòà:

In trials that were specifically designed to test the hypothesis that
vitamin D reduces the rate of progression to diabetes in
people with prediabetes (2–4), the risk for developing
diabetes was consistently lower in the group assigned
to vitamin D
than in the placebo group; however, the
observed differences were not statistically significant,
and the reported relative risk reductions (10% to 13%)
were smaller than each trial was powered to detect
(25% to 36%).


PS. Êàê-òî ðàçãîâàðèâàë ñ îäíèì ïðîôåññîðîì ïî ïîâîäó åãî ðåçóëüòàòîâ åãî èññëåäîâàíèÿ, ãäå íå áûë ñòàòèñòè÷åñêèé ýôôåêò îò íàçíà÷åíèÿ òðàíñôóçèé êîìïîíåíòîâ êðîâè íà ñìåðòíîñòü, òàê âîò èäåÿ áûëà ïîêàçàòü ÷òî íîâûé ïîäõîä ñïàñàåò ëþäåé îò ñìåðòè îò êðîâîïîòåðè, íî ðåãóëÿòîðíûå îðãàíû îáÿçàëè ââåñòè ÂÑÞ ñìåðòíîñòü êàê ïåðâè÷íàÿ òî÷êà, è êîíå÷íî âûñòðåë â ãîëîâó íå ñïàñàë îò ñìåðòè, â êàêîé êîìáèíàöèè áû òðàíñôóçèÿ íå ïðîâîäèëàñü:

Among patients with severe trauma and major bleeding, early administration of plasma, platelets, and red blood cells in a 1:1:1 ratio compared with a 1:1:2 ratio did not result in significant differences in mortality at 24 hours or at 30 days.

However, more patients in the 1:1:1 group achieved hemostasis and fewer experienced death due to exsanguination by 24 hours.
__________________
Èñêðåííå,
Âàäèì Âàëåðüåâè÷.
Îòâåòèòü ñ öèòèðîâàíèåì
  #21  
Ñòàðûé 09.05.2024, 19:37
Àâàòàð äëÿ Dr.Vad
Dr.Vad Dr.Vad âíå ôîðóìà
Ìîäåðàòîð ôîðóìà ïî ãåìàòîëîãèè
      
 
Ðåãèñòðàöèÿ: 16.01.2003
Ãîðîä: Õüþñòîí, Òåõàñ
Ñîîáùåíèé: 80,732
Ïîáëàãîäàðèëè 33,407 ðàç(à) çà 31,752 ñîîáùåíèé
Dr.Vad ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåDr.Vad ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåDr.Vad ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåDr.Vad ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåDr.Vad ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåDr.Vad ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåDr.Vad ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåDr.Vad ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåDr.Vad ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåDr.Vad ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåDr.Vad ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìå
Ïðèìåíèòåëüíî ê ïîæèëûì ïàöèåíòàì - ðåçóëüòàòû êîíñåíñóñà 2021 ãîäà, îïóáëèêîâàííîãî â 2023-ì:

This paper reports results from the 5th International Conference "Controversies in Vitamin D" that was held in Stresa, Italy, 15-18 September 2021.

Regardless of treatment strategies, interventions to restore sufficient vitamin D status will show positive results only in those who are truly deficient. Thus, treatment goals should focus on avoiding 25(OH)D serum levels <30 nmol/l (12 ng/ml), with a goal to reach levels >50 nmol/l (20 ng/dl).

The goal for adequate Vitamin D status should be to reach a serum level of 25(OH)D >50 nmol/l (20 ng/dl). It appears that daily low-dose vitamin D regimens reduce the risk of falling, especially in the elderly, compared with infrequent, large bolus doses that may increase it. The role of Vitamin D supplementation on muscle strength remains to be clarified. On the other hand, supplementation decreases the risk of progression to T2D from prediabetes among those who are Vitamin D-deficient.
---
Endocrine. 2023 Jan;79(1):31-44.
Vitamin D in the older population: a consensus statement
__________________
Èñêðåííå,
Âàäèì Âàëåðüåâè÷.
Îòâåòèòü ñ öèòèðîâàíèåì
  #22  
Ñòàðûé 09.05.2024, 19:57
Àâàòàð äëÿ Melnichenko
Melnichenko Melnichenko íà ôîðóìå
ÂÐÀ×
      
 
Ðåãèñòðàöèÿ: 26.07.2001
Ãîðîä: Ìîñêâà
Ñîîáùåíèé: 117,410
Ñêàçàë(à) ñïàñèáî: 26
Ïîáëàãîäàðèëè 33,669 ðàç(à) çà 32,743 ñîîáùåíèé
Melnichenko ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåMelnichenko ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåMelnichenko ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåMelnichenko ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåMelnichenko ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåMelnichenko ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåMelnichenko ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåMelnichenko ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåMelnichenko ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåMelnichenko ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåMelnichenko ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìå
Íìîëü/ ë íå íã/ ìë
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Ã.À. Ìåëüíè÷åíêî
Îòâåòèòü ñ öèòèðîâàíèåì
  #23  
Ñòàðûé 10.05.2024, 10:05
Ninagr Ninagr âíå ôîðóìà Ïîë æåíñêèé
Íà÷èíàþùèé ó÷àñòíèê
 
Ðåãèñòðàöèÿ: 03.05.2024
Ãîðîä: Ñàíêò-Ïåòåðáóðã
Ñîîáùåíèé: 22
Ñêàçàë(à) ñïàñèáî: 16
Ninagr *
Ñïàñèáî, íàñêîëüêî ïîíÿëà ðàçíèöû âëèÿíèÿ íà ïî÷êè ìåæäó ðîçóâîñòàòèíîì è àòîðâîñòàòèíîì íåò. À êàê íàñ÷¸ò âëèÿíèÿ íà ìûøöû?
Ó ìåíÿ õîëåñòåðèí ëó÷øå ñíèæàåòñÿ íà ðîçóâîñòàòèíå, íî ÷åðåç 15 ëåò ñòàëè áîëåòü ìûøöû, ðåøèëà ïîìåíÿòü íà àòîðâîñòàòèí â ñîîòâåòñòâóþùåé äîçå, õîëåñòåðèí ïîäíÿëñÿ.
Îòâåòèòü ñ öèòèðîâàíèåì
  #24  
Ñòàðûé 10.05.2024, 10:38
ELENA_VLAD ELENA_VLAD íà ôîðóìå
ÂÐÀ×
      
 
Ðåãèñòðàöèÿ: 24.07.2008
Ãîðîä: Êðàñíîÿðñê
Ñîîáùåíèé: 6,990
Ñêàçàë(à) ñïàñèáî: 278
Ïîáëàãîäàðèëè 2,147 ðàç(à) çà 2,072 ñîîáùåíèé
ELENA_VLAD ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåELENA_VLAD ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåELENA_VLAD ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåELENA_VLAD ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåELENA_VLAD ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåELENA_VLAD ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåELENA_VLAD ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåELENA_VLAD ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåELENA_VLAD ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåELENA_VLAD ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåELENA_VLAD ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìå
Àòîðâàñòàòèí ñëàáåå è äîçà åãî äîëæíà áûòü áîëüøå â ïîëòîðà-äâà ðàçà
Îòâåòèòü ñ öèòèðîâàíèåì
  #25  
Ñòàðûé 10.05.2024, 11:45
Àâàòàð äëÿ Melnichenko
Melnichenko Melnichenko íà ôîðóìå
ÂÐÀ×
      
 
Ðåãèñòðàöèÿ: 26.07.2001
Ãîðîä: Ìîñêâà
Ñîîáùåíèé: 117,410
Ñêàçàë(à) ñïàñèáî: 26
Ïîáëàãîäàðèëè 33,669 ðàç(à) çà 32,743 ñîîáùåíèé
Melnichenko ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåMelnichenko ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåMelnichenko ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåMelnichenko ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåMelnichenko ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåMelnichenko ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåMelnichenko ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåMelnichenko ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåMelnichenko ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåMelnichenko ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåMelnichenko ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìå
Êñòàòè, ðàçðûâàòü èñòîðèþ è ïèñàòü îòäåëüíî îá óõóäøåíèè ïîñëåäíèõ ìåñÿöåâ â äðóãîé òåìå- çà÷åì?
__________________
Ã.À. Ìåëüíè÷åíêî
Îòâåòèòü ñ öèòèðîâàíèåì
  #26  
Ñòàðûé 10.05.2024, 15:25
Ninagr Ninagr âíå ôîðóìà Ïîë æåíñêèé
Íà÷èíàþùèé ó÷àñòíèê
 
Ðåãèñòðàöèÿ: 03.05.2024
Ãîðîä: Ñàíêò-Ïåòåðáóðã
Ñîîáùåíèé: 22
Ñêàçàë(à) ñïàñèáî: 16
Ninagr *
Ñïàñèáî, íàñêîëüêî ïîíÿëà ðàçíèöû âëèÿíèÿ íà ïî÷êè ìåæäó ðîçóâîñòàòèíîì è àòîðâîñòàòèíîì íåò. À êàê íàñ÷¸ò âëèÿíèÿ íà ìûøöû?
Ó ìåíÿ õîëåñòåðèí ëó÷øå ñíèæàåòñÿ íà ðîçóâîñòàòèíå, íî ÷åðåç 15 ëåò ñòàëè áîëåòü ìûøöû, ðåøèëà ïîìåíÿòü íà àòîðâîñòàòèí â ñîîòâåòñòâóþùåé äîçå, õîëåñòåðèí ïîäíÿëñÿ
Îòâåòèòü ñ öèòèðîâàíèåì
  #27  
Ñòàðûé 10.05.2024, 15:44
Àâàòàð äëÿ Korzun
Korzun Korzun íà ôîðóìå
ÂÐÀ×
      
 
Ðåãèñòðàöèÿ: 15.03.2005
Ãîðîä: Ãåðìàíèÿ
Ñîîáùåíèé: 24,608
Ñêàçàë(à) ñïàñèáî: 1
Ïîáëàãîäàðèëè 10,528 ðàç(à) çà 9,695 ñîîáùåíèé
Korzun ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåKorzun ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåKorzun ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåKorzun ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåKorzun ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåKorzun ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåKorzun ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåKorzun ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåKorzun ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåKorzun ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåKorzun ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìå
Åñòü åùå ïèòàâÀñòàòèí (ëèâàçî; âñå ýòè ïðåïàðàòû âÀñòàòèíû, à íå âÎñòàòèíû). Îí ïîñèëüíåé áóäåò è ìåíüøå ïîáî÷íûõ äåéñòâèé.
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Àëåêñàíäð Èâàíîâè÷
ñ ïîæåëàíèÿìè êðåïêîãî çäîðîâüÿ
Îòâåòèòü ñ öèòèðîâàíèåì
  #28  
Ñòàðûé 10.05.2024, 15:47
ghrh44 ghrh44 âíå ôîðóìà
ÂÐÀ×
      
 
Ðåãèñòðàöèÿ: 21.07.2014
Ãîðîä: N-sk
Ñîîáùåíèé: 3,999
Ïîáëàãîäàðèëè 2,051 ðàç(à) çà 1,895 ñîîáùåíèé
ghrh44 ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåghrh44 ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåghrh44 ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåghrh44 ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåghrh44 ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåghrh44 ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåghrh44 ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåghrh44 ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåghrh44 ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåghrh44 ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåghrh44 ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìå
Äóáëü
__________________
Dr.B
Îòâåòèòü ñ öèòèðîâàíèåì
  #29  
Ñòàðûé 10.05.2024, 15:51
ghrh44 ghrh44 âíå ôîðóìà
ÂÐÀ×
      
 
Ðåãèñòðàöèÿ: 21.07.2014
Ãîðîä: N-sk
Ñîîáùåíèé: 3,999
Ïîáëàãîäàðèëè 2,051 ðàç(à) çà 1,895 ñîîáùåíèé
ghrh44 ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåghrh44 ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåghrh44 ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåghrh44 ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåghrh44 ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåghrh44 ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåghrh44 ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåghrh44 ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåghrh44 ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåghrh44 ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåghrh44 ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìå
Question

Öèòàòà:
Ñîîáùåíèå îò Ninagr Ïîñìîòðåòü ñîîáùåíèå
Ñïàñèáî, íàñêîëüêî ïîíÿëà ðàçíèöû âëèÿíèÿ íà ïî÷êè ìåæäó ðîçóâîñòàòèíîì è àòîðâîñòàòèíîì íåò. À êàê íàñ÷¸ò âëèÿíèÿ íà ìûøöû?
Ó ìåíÿ õîëåñòåðèí ëó÷øå ñíèæàåòñÿ íà ðîçóâîñòàòèíå, íî ÷åðåç 15 ëåò ñòàëè áîëåòü ìûøöû, ðåøèëà ïîìåíÿòü íà àòîðâîñòàòèí â ñîîòâåòñòâóþùåé äîçå, õîëåñòåðèí ïîäíÿëñÿ
Âñå ñòàòèíû, îñîáåííî â âûñîêèõ äîçàõ è â ñî÷åòàíèè ñ ôåíîôèáðàòîì ìîãóò âûçâàòü ìûøå÷íûå áîëè èç-çà ðàçâèòèÿ ìèîçèòà (âîñïàëåíèÿ ìûøö). Ýòî ëåãêî îïðåäåëèòü: èçìåðèòü KÔÊ.
Íî êàê-òî â ìèîçèò ïîñëå àæ 15 ëåò ïðèåìà ðîçóâàñòàòèíà íå î÷åíü âåðèòñÿ.
Áîëè ïðîøëè ïîñëå åãî îòìåíû? Ëèïèäû íà íåì áûëè íîðìàëüíû?
Íî ãëàâíàÿ öåëü ñòàòèíîâ ýòî èìåííî íîðìàëèçàöèÿ ëèïèäîâ, à àòîðâàñòàòèí â ðàçû ñëàáåå ðîçóâàñòàòèíà. Òóò íàäî èëè ïîâûñèòü äîçó àòîðâàñòàòèíà, èëè âåðíóòüñÿ íà ðîçóâàñòàòèí â íèçøåé äîçå, ÷òî Âàì óæå è áûëî ïðåäëîæåíî ( ñì. ïîñò Åëåíà_Âëàä).
__________________
Dr.B
Îòâåòèòü ñ öèòèðîâàíèåì
  #30  
Ñòàðûé 11.05.2024, 12:32
Ninagr Ninagr âíå ôîðóìà Ïîë æåíñêèé
Íà÷èíàþùèé ó÷àñòíèê
 
Ðåãèñòðàöèÿ: 03.05.2024
Ãîðîä: Ñàíêò-Ïåòåðáóðã
Ñîîáùåíèé: 22
Ñêàçàë(à) ñïàñèáî: 16
Ninagr *
Ïîñëå îòìåíû ðîçóâîñòàòèíà ìûøå÷íûå áîëè â íîãàõ ïðîøëè, íî, âîçìîæíî, ýòî ñîâïàäåíèå. Ïîñêîëüêó îí íàìíîãî ñèëüíåå è êàê óêàçàíî âûøå íà ïî÷êè íå âëèÿåò, ñîáèðàþñü ñíîâà ïåðåéòè íà íåãî. Íàâåðíîå íåëüçÿ çàäàâàòü òàêîé âîïðîñ, íî âñå òàêè êàêîé ôèðìû ëó÷øå?
Îòâåòèòü ñ öèòèðîâàíèåì
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